Old Bus Photos

Edward Thomas and Son – Leyland Tiger Cub – 6217 PU

6217 PU

Edward Thomas and Son
1961
Leyland Tiger Cub PSUC1/2
Duple C41F

This is a Leyland Tiger Cub PSUC1/2 with a Duple Donington C41F body that was bought initially for staff transport by the Shell Oil company in 1961. It went to Edward Thomas of West Ewell, near Epsom, Surrey in November 1968, who in turn disposed of it in December 1974 to Trevor Brown, proprietor of the Tillingbourne Bus Company. In December 1975 it was sold to Hargreaves of Newbury. 6217 PU is seen here in Tillingbourne ownership, though still wearing the livery of Edward Thomas, parked in the yard beside Gomshall railway station that then served as Tillingbourne’s operating base, to the chagrin of Guildford Borough Council who consistently pressured the company to find other premises. I always liked the Tiger Cub model, though the five speed constant mesh gearbox required proper respect for clean changes, and the Donington body (this is the second version, still with shallow windows), together with the Elizabethan and Britannia, represented  Duple UF bodywork design at its best. Thereafter in the 1960s Duple abandoned all restraint and went completely downhill in my view, initially by adopting a  bulbous front end derived from the front engined models, and later going completely overboard with a mish mash of uncoordinated styling features embellished with a truly ghastly, garish, Detroit ‘inspired’ front grille. Even when the firm finally pulled itself together and adopted the Plaxton clone Dominant design it was still just a pale imitation of the Scarborough original.

Photograph and Copy contributed by Roger Cox


13/06/16 – 17:17

6217 PU_2

Whilst not the best image and taken from my slide , I can attach a picture of 6217PU repainted into Tillingbourne colours and seen in Shere village.

Keith Newton


14/06/16 – 06:07

When did the Tillingbourne livery change from the maroon?
I seem to remember, from using Guildford bus stations through to as late as 1959 that their buses and Brady,s Brown Buses were actually quite close in colour/hue.

John Lomas


14/06/16 – 11:16

Does anybody have a picture of this in Shell Oil livery? If it was in the same corporate colours as their tanker fleet it might be quite attractive.

Neville Mercer


14/06/16 – 17:43

9712 WX

On 30 September 1970, Trevor Wilcox Brown of Grayshott bought the Tillingbourne Valley operations and its GS buses From the Trice family that had started the business on Easter Bank Holiday in 1924. At first the maroon livery and Tillingbourne Valley trading name continued, though slightly changed, but in April 1972, GS MXX 364 appeared in a new livery of blue with a white roof and a yellow relief band below the windows. The company became the Tillingbourne Bus Company and the fleetname, in a bolder style, was reduced to just ‘Tillingbourne’. This then became the fleet standard but, over subsequent years until the company’s abrupt demise in April 2001, the livery underwent several changes with yellow generally becoming the predominant colour. Back to the Tillingbourne Tiger Cubs. The company had three of these with Donington bodywork, the one shown above plus two from Pennine of Gargrave, 6108 WU and 9712 WX. A fourth Tiger Cub in the fleet, VCH 172, had a Willowbrook DP41F body, and came from Watson’s and Goodman’s & Tours, t/a Ford of Gunnislake. Here is a shot of 9712 WX pictured during one of my Saturday driving stints with it on the 450 Farley Green – Guildford route in 1974. This vehicle had the final and in my opinion the best version of the Donington body, with deeper saloon windows that matched the height of the windscreen. It was a very pleasant vehicle to drive.

Roger Cox


15/06/16 – 07:10

The recent picture of 6217 PU made me (excitedly) put pen to paper and before I knew it I have written a bit of a personal memoir of the Shell Refining private bus service that operated in the 1950s until the mid 1960s. I am afraid I have strayed well of the mark for an answer to the question what colour was it when new – which is what kicked off my thoughts. Perhaps you might like to start it as a new subject though it is a bit short on bus detail. I was after all, only eight when 6217 PU was new. I have referenced some other local activities too. All photos are from my collection and the one of 838 HNO was taken by the late Peter Snell who gave me a copy years ago.

Nick Webster

Nicks copy and photos can be viewed at this link ‘Shell Refining’s Private Bus Service’


 

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East Yorkshire – Leyland Tiger Cub – 6692/3 KH – 692/3

East Yorkshire - Leyland Tiger Cub - 6692/3 KH - 692/3

East Yorkshire Motor Services
1960
Leyland Tiger Cub PSUC1/2
Harrington C35F

This is the pretty village of Thornton le Dale in North Yorkshire on 11th June 1968. A pair of East Yorkshire Tiger Cubs are parked up amongst the cars awaiting the return of their tour passengers. Elegant, attractive coaches enhanced by the livery and the classy gothic script fleetname.

Photograph and Copy contributed by Ian Wild


27/12/15 – 09:02

Thanks for posting, Ian. These vehicles appear to have carried names. The EFE model of 692 has her named as Pocklington Star.

Pete Davies


28/12/15 – 06:32

Pocklington Star still exists, it was bought last year by Richard Macallister of Sowerby Bridge

Don McKeown


28/12/15 – 06:34

So far as I know, nine of these East Yorkshire Leyland PSU1/2 Tiger Cub coaches were given names;
675 WAT 675 Humber Star
676 WAT 676 Dales Star
677 WAT 677 Wold Star
678 WAT 678 Buckrose Star
679 WAT 679 Hunsley Star
692 6692 KH Pocklington Star
693 6693 KH Holderness Star
694 6694 KH Driffield Star
695 6695 KH Middleton Star

Ron Mesure


29/12/15 – 09:34

East Yorkshire still name some of their coaches with these names.

Chris Hough


30/12/15 – 06:33

The Tiger Cub was PSUC not PSU. The EYMS ones were late examples of the PSUC1/2, the O:400 powered PSUC1/12 was introduced soon after.

Stephen Allcroft


30/12/15 – 06:33

Just one point of divergence. I would not myself describe the use of a difficult-to-read name style like this as classy! It was someone’s idea of classy perhaps, but firstly it is not Gothic in the strict sense- Old English may be better- and it commits the great sin of departing from a company house style. The great examples of a good-looking easy to read style- apart from the timeless LT Gill Sans- were Transport or Rail Alphabet used- and mostly still used- for road signs and railways. These did drag some of the bus industry into the 20th Century, but some were still using transfers from the year dot until NBC brought decent typography but awful colours to our buses. I am not a graphic designer but I know what I like!

Joe


30/12/15 – 13:58

The truth comes out! "Joe" is really a pseudonym for Ray Stenning! Happy New Year to one and all.

Neville Mercer


31/12/15 – 07:18

Joe, LT and TfL do not use Gill Sans type face. Since the formation of the L.P.T.B. in 1933, transport in London has used Johnston type face which had been used from 1916 by the predecessor companies.
Eric Gill, who was a student of Johnston, introduced the Gill Sans type face in 1928 and this has subtle differences from the Johnston one.

John Kaye


31/12/15 – 07:19

Oh! Joe. Cue ‘Eastenders’ drum effects! Happy New Year Neville and Joe – and of course wishing a Happy New Year to everyone else as well.

Brendan Smith


31/12/15 – 10:47

No, Neville, you have unmasked the wrong man. It was the butler. Or Colonel Mustard-and-Purple. I do not subscribe to the idea that liveries went wacko only recently- look at "streamlining" or those spats and swoops- but in the main the conservatism of the old big groups kept things very staid. I am really talking only of fleetnames, house styles and logos. The last Sheffield transport logo was very neat but for true minimalism, you need Doncaster Corporation: not only did the blinds tell you little else but the terminus it was coming from or going to- no route numbers- there was only a coat of arms with the motto "Comfort and Joy" (in Latin because it was Donny) which did not really fit the vibrating Utility AEC still doing valiant service.

Joe


01/01/16 – 07:01

I must take issue with Joe’s comment that the East Yorkshire fleetname on these vehicles "…commits the great sin of departing from a company house style."
The point here is that the company had a separate house style (or corporate identity) for the coaching part of its operations. This was not at all unusual – many of the "company" or area agreement operators used a different livery for their coaching activities. Sometimes it was just a different arrangement of the bus fleet colours (typically, a "reversed" livery), others used different colours (e.g. West Yorkshire, Eastern Counties, Crosville or Rhondda), while others also used a different style of fleetname, as East Yorkshire did – e.g. United, Western Welsh or Bristol Greyhound). Some went even further, and used a different name as well as livery for their coaching divisions, e.g. Devon General with Grey Cars or Western and Southern National with Royal Blue. The same could, of course, be said about the NBC itself. So the concept of a separate identity for the coaching business is certainly not unusual, and I certainly would not call it a "great sin". I have no doubt that the companies concerned did so for good business reasons.
As far as the font used, I would not dispute that clarity and ease of reading are important for things like destination blinds and other notices and signs. Fleetnames, however, are in a slightly different category, in that they often serve as the company logo as well, so that ease of reading is not necessarily the first priority. The NBC fleetnames were certainly bold, in some cases more so than their predecessors, but rather uninteresting as well – but I do agree that the colours were dire.

Nigel Frampton


01/01/16 – 07:01

WAT 677

EY

Can not agree about a difficult to read fleet name as I think my pic of 677 on 24 August 1968 in the Coach Station demonstrates.

Malcolm Wells


03/01/16 – 16:19

In the early 1960’s, I worked as a Conductor at Colchester ENOC depot, during vacation from College. East Yorkshire’s Harrington Tiger Cub "Pocklington Star" was a regular visitor to the depot as one of their tours overnighted at The George in Colchester. The vehicle looked quite splendid among all the Green and Cream Bristols.

Russell Howard


04/01/16 – 06:25

"NBC brought in decent typography"??? The fleet name lettering on NBC buses was unimaginative, ugly and crude, well in keeping with NBC’s centralised, blunderbus approach to many aspects of the industry. The font used was a modified bold version of Futura Bk, tidied up a bit to make the letters look more evenly spaced to the eye. NBC’s Henry Ford attitude to bus liveries – any colour you like as long as it’s red or green – negated any identification benefit that the heavy fleetname might have afforded. Like the Malvina Reynolds "Little Boxes" song, they all looked just the same, but worse – even the colour distinctions were denied. Freddie Wood’s NBC trumpeted that it was "The Biggest Bus Company In The World", and bland uniformity was the name of the game. In the days preceding NBC corporatism, fleetname styles and company colours represented the identities of individual operators, just as the logos of Kelloggs or Ford or Boots, for example, have stood the identification test of decades. You don’t require to read the lettering on a Mars Bar at sixty paces to know what you are buying, any more than bus passengers of the past needed to peer myopically at the fleetname of the local double decker before boarding the thing. The decipherability of destination blinds is a different issue altogether. It is invariably advisable to ensure that one’s travel objective is shared by the driver of the bus one is travelling on.

Roger Cox


15/04/16 – 07:12

East Yorkshire Stars: Went on a tour of the Yorkshire Dales when the whole fleet of Cavaliers were present. I seem to remember that there was a 36ft version called Bridlington Star. A one-off. Do I remember rightly?

Mike


 

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Jones, Aberbeeg – Leyland Tiger Cub – 889 AAX – 98

Jones Aberbeeg - Leyland Tiger Cub - 889 AAX - 98

Jones, Aberbeeg
1961
Leyland Tiger Cub
Weymann B44F

889AAX is a Leyland Tiger Cub from the fleet of Jones, Aberbeeg. According to the Keith Jenkinson book of 1978, she is an OPSUC1/3 from 1959 with conversion to OPSUC1/3T at a later date. The PSVC listing for 2013 shows her without the ‘T’ suffix and says she was first registered in 1961, so she must have been stored for a while. The body is by Weymann, to B44F configuration. We see her in Netley, on her way to the rally on 9 July 1995.

Photograph and Copy contributed by Pete Davies


18/06/15 – 10:50

It’s quite unusual for there to be a significant delay between construction and entry into service. The chassis numbers of these vehicles indicate that construction of their chassis was commenced in late 1958, and most vehicles with similar-age numbers entered service in 1959. The Weymann body numbers similarly indicate 1959 vehicles, but chassis/body numbers were often issued when the relevant bit was ordered, rather than when it was actually constructed, so it’s not possible to draw any firm conclusions there. (Leyland were an exception to this).
The registration AAX reversed dates from 11/60 to 2/61, so it would appear that these vehicles were indeed registered (or possibly re-registered) in early 1961.
BLOTW gives the chassis designation as home-market PSUC1/3 rather than OPSUC1/3, but, either way, it would seem that these vehicles were among the minority of Tiger Cubs to feature epicyclic gearboxes.

David Call


18/06/15 – 16:48

I believe this bus was part of a cancelled export order for Trinidad, which would explain the delay between construction and registration.

Roy Nicholson


20/06/15 – 15:11

Do you mean that it would have taken a while to get the vehicles back from Trinidad? I’m not sure I follow the logic.
I see that I omitted to mention the fact that the batch was of three vehicles, Jones 98-100 (889-91 AAX).

David Call


21/06/15 – 05:56

David, I may be wrong – I usually am! – but I suspect what Roy means is that the vehicles were constructed but never exported, being stored until a buyer was found.

Pete Davies


21/06/15 – 05:57

As originally built the windscreens included push-out ventilators at the bottom, as might be required for hotter climes. These were removed by Jones because, as far as I recall, they were not water-tight.
I presume the order must have been cancelled at a very late stage during bodying (why? – penalties would have to be paid), and that the bodied vehicles then sat around until an operator was prepared to pay for some semi-auto Tiger Cubs . . . and that operator must have been Jones.

Philip Rushworth


21/06/15 – 05:58

Doug Jack refers to these in ‘The Leyland Bus’ – "Three overseas OPSUC1/3’s with Weymann bodywork (B44F) were diverted in 1960 from Trinidad Agencies to Jones of Aberbeeg."

David Williamson


22/10/15 – 07:26

889 AAX

The picture of the Jones tiger cub on the way to Netley rally has me driving it as I was the owner at the time. Regarding the difference in build and going into service was as was mentioned, a cancelled order. Three were left at Southampton docks so I was told. They originally had full length sliding side windows as well as the push out vents in the windscreens.
While at Netley rally, I discovered I had a slow puncture in the front offside tyre, so had to put the spare on. This was of dubious condition as it was on the bus when I bought it. I took it easy on the return journey to South Gloustershire, but as I exited the roundabout at Salisbury collage there was a bang , it had blown. So there we were with no back-up Luckily I had a good few passengers, so we jacked it up intending to put the original tyre on. As luck would have it, another old bus from the rally appeared and the owner offered to take it to a garage and inflate it, so although it was slowly leaking, we got back home safely, albeit with a rather deflated tyre.

Alan Roberts


 

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Old Bus Photos from Saturday 25th April 2009 to Sunday 31st July 2016