Old Bus Photos

Tynemouth and District – Leyland Titan TD5 – FT 4498 – 98

Tynemouth and District – Leyland Titan TD5 – FT 4498 – 98
Copyright Unknown

Tynemouth and District
1938
Leyland Titan TD5
Weymann H??F

More from my youth. 98 was one of eight 1938 forward entrance Weymann bodied Leyland TD5’s delivered to the Northern General subsidiary of Tynemouth and District. They were FT 4496/4503 numbers 96/103. About 1950 in common with many pre war vehicles they were given a new lease of life and re bodied.

Tynemouth and District – Leyland Titan TD5 – FT 4500
Copyright Unknown

100 is seen here with its second body, and you could be forgiven for asking how ECW bodies came to be in a BET fleet? Well in fact they’re Northern Coachbuilders H30/26R. I’m aware of one example of the type that’s still around, NVK 341 is a beautifully restored 1950 Newcastle Corporation AEC Regent 111 and has been featured on this site. I don’t know if the doors on the Weymann’s were powered or manual and almost certainly they would not have been equipped with heaters, but they seem to have been well ahead of their time. Does anyone know of any survivors?

Photograph and Copy contributed by Ronnie Hoye


18/12/12 – 16:35

I am not familiar with Northern General, but the forward entrance Weymann body looks very much like the ones mounted on AEC Regent chassis for Midland General in the late 30s. I can remember travelling on one of these about 1953 on the C5 Alfreton to Nottingham route. I don’t think the sliding doors were powered. Trent also had some similar ones, but these were rebodied with conventional rear entrance Willowbrook bodies (lowbridge from memory) around 1950 I think. It’s remarkable to that immediately before WW2 Nottingham had three different operators with forward entrance double deckers – since Barton also had quite a lot of Leylands, some of them rebodies of older vehicles bought second hand. These were not Weymanns however.

Stephen Ford


19/12/12 – 07:32

I’m very pleased you mentioned those Stephen because one thing I noticed was that although the Trent and Midland General Regents both dated from 1937 and both were bodied by Weymann, they were somewhat different. The MGO bodies were basically same as the Tynemouth example above. The Trent examples had an odd, longer length second window bay which resulted in a much shorter rearmost side window on both decks. Also, the bulkhead under the canopy had a single window on the MGO vehicles whereas on the Trent ones, there were twin windows. So, it would seem that Weymann had more than one front entrance double deck design in production at the same time. It makes you wonder why certain operators preferred such subtle differences.

Chris Barker


19/12/12 – 07:32

Some very nice views there, Ronnie!

Pete Davies


19/12/12 – 08:45

Weymann were renown for their metal framed bodywork and classic designs. Pre-war, there were three separate products – Flexible, Coachbuilt and Metal. Coachbuilt approximated to the composite framework used by Charles H Roe up to 1968. The featured body is a composite body. Mansfield District/Midland General had both composite and metal bodies in the pre-war period.

David Oldfield


19/12/12 – 13:39

The first photograph – that’s an original, right ?

After classic coaches, the second love of my life is the amber nectar….I’m not a historian, but genuinely amazed that Carlsberg existed all those years ago and, even more amazement, they hoped to sell it in the North East in competition with Newcastle Brown !!

Stuart C


20/12/12 – 08:05

Stuart, according to the encyclopaedia website, that brewing company was founded in 1847, and now controls a fair number of brands. The list might make you weep into your drink but includes Tetley and Scottish & Newcastle . . .

Pete Davies


20/12/12 – 09:39

An equally surprising ‘brewing’ fact is that lager, per se, was so popular in an era when most folk seemed to drink ale, porter or mild and bitter. I’ve seen pre- 1914 adverts on trams for Tuborg lager and one, dated 1908, for ‘Alsopp’s British Lager’ To me, lager seemed to take off in the late 1950’s.

Chris Hebbron


20/12/12 – 09:43

Presumably you stuck your Carlsberg on a boat and just headed west. Do you notice that they were anxious to explain that Lager (or Pilsner if you not sure what to call the stuff although it was always a long way from Pilsn) was not just a cold summer drink…? They succeeded!

Joe


21/12/12 – 07:27

Unusual to see a bus that looked so good in both incarnations, though for sheer character I go for the front-entrance original. The nice lining-out and dignified fleet name are a fine finishing touch. Did Northern Coachbuilders build these ECW lookalikes on licence, or to order, or simply as the sincerest form of flattery? Their own designs always look very good to my eye as well.

Ian Thompson


21/12/12 – 10:40

Ian. An ECW man was enticed to NCB just before NCB’s major shareholder died and they were landed with crippling death duties which did for the company. This body is closer to ECW’s original than the Newcastle Regent III – which has slightly odd (uneven) bay spacing.

David Oldfield


22/12/12 – 14:55

I can remember seeing these front entrance double deckers on the Blyth – North Shields Ferry service 7 as a small boy around 1949-50 an once did a return trip on one accompanied by my aunt. These were very different to the usual AEC Regents allocated to this route.

Gerald Walker


07/11/14 – 06:19

I have enjoyed looking at the old photos I worked at Percy Main from 1963 until 1969 but I can not remember Ronnie Hoye but you sure know your buses.

Ray 33323


07/11/14 – 15:39

Ray, do you have a Brother called Brian, who was a fitter at Percy Main?

Ronnie Hoye


 

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Trent – AEC Regal I – RC 9668/74 – 303/768

Trent - AEC Regal I - RC 9668/74 - 303/768
Copyright Bob Gell

Trent Motor Traction 303                            Trent Motor Traction 768
1947                                                            1947
AEC Regal I                                                  AEC Regal I
Willowbrook FDP39F                                  Willowbrook B35F

A company not yet represented on this site is Trent Motor Traction, so this photo is to rectify that omission. In the early postwar years, Trent took delivery of a large number of AEC Regals with Willowbrook bus bodies. In 1958, some 20 of the Regals were modernised by Willowbrook, who fitted a full front, extended the chassis and lengthened the body to 30 feet, increasing the capacity from 35 to 39.
The rebuilt vehicles were treated as dual purpose, which meant they saw use on local services (the only time I rode on one was on the Derby ‘town service’ 27 from Scarborough Rise to the bus station), and also express services, often to the East Coast on summer Saturdays.
I’m not sure how much of a success they were, as they were withdrawn in 1962/3, only 2/3 years after the last of the unrebuilt examples.
My photograph shows rebuilt 303 (RC 9668) and unrebuilt 768 (RC 9674), both from the 1947 batch, at Derby Bus Station in 1960.

Photograph and Copy contributed by Bob Gell


16/12/12 – 11:03

Extending the chassis and fitting a new body? Sounds rather like the Tilling fleets with the Bristol L to LL conversion. Who’s idea was it?

Pete Davies


16/12/12 – 12:20

Were not some of these Regals lengthened by Trent themselves but remained half cabs?

Eric Bawden


16/12/12 – 14:47

I found this site by accident (What a fascinating place the internet can be) and have been delighted with the photographs and comments. I was with Trent from 1965 to 1967 prior to emigrating to Western Australia. I worked at the Hucknall depot in Nottinghamshire where we drove mainly Leyland PD2’s and 3’s plus Atlanteans and Daimler Fleetlines. I never gave a thought, sadly, to taking photographs but I have found a few examples of vehicles similar to those that I drove. If anyone has examples of Trent buses I would love to see them.

Malcolm Holmes


17/12/12 – 08:14

When I was a nipper we took holidays at Skegness and we stayed at digs near the coach park! I seem to recall one of the full front vehicle was used as some kind of booking office. Have I got this right? My father who had the same initials RC often commented the number plate would be just right for his own car this being before the craze was the general norm.

Philip Carlton


18/12/12 – 08:00

To answer a couple of points, the rebuilt vehicles didn’t have new bodies. As Bob rightly states, the original bodies simply had the rearmost bay extended to achieve 30ft length and provide four extra seats. In halfcab form they had been used on long distance express services but attracted complaints from passengers because the original bus seats were very low backed. The rebuilt vehicles were given dual purpose seats although these were still rather spartan. The rebuilds gave between four and five years service, the last being sixteen years old when withdrawn, I suppose that was quite creditable for Trent who usually worked to a twelve year maximum fleet life.
I’ve never known if the AEC radiator was retained behind the full fronts but the rebuilt vehicles had a reputation for getting extremely hot in the cabs and were known as ‘sweat boxes’ None of them were extended and retained half cabs. Quite a few rebuilds saw further service after leaving Trent. The mobile booking office at Skegness was a much earlier vehicle, a pre-war SOS.

Chris Barker


19/12/12 – 07:22

Chris – Thanks for the additional information.
The pre war SOS mobile booking office (RC 2721) was saved for preservation, and is currently being restored by LVVS at Lincoln.

Bob Gell


13/06/13 – 11:34

As a fitter and a manager working at Trent for 30 years 1962 to 1992 I can confirm that the lengthened AEC Regals were indeed "sweatboxes" working on the engine in the cab in thick overalls on a hot day had to be believed! they did not retain the original AEC radiator but a flat metal affair, where they came from I am not sure. The conversions were all carried out at Willowbrook but for me they did not look right. As a matter of interest my boss at Trent for 25 years Malcolm Hitchen MBE is currently writing about his 50 years with Trent engineering hopefully to be published to coincide with Trent 100 years in October 2013

Alan Hiley


RC 9668-74_lr Vehicle reminder shot for this posting


24/08/13 – 15:27

RC 2721

There is mention on this Trent page of a mobile booking office used at Skegness. This was RC 2721 a 1935 BMMO DON converted to the booking office in May 1953, acquired by the Lincolnshire Vintage Vehicle Society in April 1965. Still with them in 2013 and being put back to its original condition.

Alan Hiley


03/09/13 – 06:00

RC 2721_2

Alan Hiley in his contribution of 24/08/2013 makes mention of Trent Motor Traction Co., 1935 BMMO DON – RC 2721 being with the Lincolnshire Vintage Vehicle Society, in preservation.
I thought you would like to see it in their ownership.

Stephen Howarth


 

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Hants & Dorset – Bristol MW6G – 7123 LJ – 1833

Hants & Dorset - Bristol MW6G - 7123 LJ - 1833
Copyright Pete Davies

Hants & Dorset Motor Services
1962
Bristol MW6G
ECW C39F

This Bristol MW with, as it was called then, the ‘New Look’ design was new to Hants & Dorset as their fleet number 887 in June 1962. In 1963 the batch (882 – 887) were down seated to C30F for extended tours, but reverted to C39F in 1968. In the first view, she has been downgraded to local bus work, as DP41F and is in special livery for the RED FUNNEL FERRIES contract and is seen at Southampton Central Station in April 1974. Her sister, 7122 LJ, was in BRITISH RAIL SEASPEED livery at the same time, but my view of the sister is not suitable for publication.

Hants & Dorset - Bristol MW6G - 7123 LJ - 1833
Copyright Pete Davies

In the second view of 7123 LJ, the relegation to service bus duty is complete, having been repainted in NBC poppy red livery with white stripe in 1975. She’s in the yard of Southampton depot in January 1976. In both views, she has the fleet number 1833 but for a brief time in 1971 she had the fleet number 1001.

Photograph and Copy contributed by Pete Davies

———

14/12/12 – 07:21

Never thought NBC poppy red could be an improvement on another livery but…..

Eric Bawden

———

14/12/12 – 07:22

When I photographed sister vehicle 1831 in 1973 on local service at Winchester, she was still fitted with high back seats. I’m amused by the fact that in the upper view, 1833 retains wheel trims, but has been relegated to bus seating.

Alan Murray-Rust

———

14/12/12 – 08:50

Indeed, Eric! I have vague memories that Southern Vectis had a vehicle in similar livery, for the Cowes to Newport element of this service, though I never photographed it. The service connected with the express trains from Waterloo and, in later years, had the service number 91, to match the train headcode! Different people have operated the link over the years, including Marchwood Motorways (using a Ford with Duple coach body and special livery) and Southampton Citybus (both before and after they sold out to First) Current operation is called "City Link" and the Unilink version of Solent Blue Line runs it.

Pete Davies

———

14/12/12 – 10:44

I like to think that even me, colour-blind, would not have come up with such a hideous range of colours and patterns as the poor suffering bus has in the top photo. Sun glasses might have helped! I always liked the ‘New Look’.

Chris Hebbron

———

14/12/12 – 16:26

Just a different way of applying poppy and white, Mr H!!!

Pete Davies

———

15/12/12 – 12:00

Mansfield District had some of these type vehicles, good looking coaches when new, however, the downgrade to DP services saw the addition of the linen box grafted onto the front dome, it spoilt ’em though at least Mansfield fully removed the original two boxes above the headlights.

Berisford Jones

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15/12/12 – 14:32

Berisford, I’m not sure what happened to this batch with Hants & Dorset, but most of the H&D coaches just had the box, illuminated, with the lettering HANTS & DORSET under the driver and HOLIDAY TOURS in the other one. Some of the RE coaches, down to NBC DP livery, had the HOLI removed.
Yes, removal of the box would probably have made the outline better!

Pete Davies

———

15/12/12 – 16:21

I like the design of these vehicles – I don’t like the destination box. For comparison take a look at a similar Royal Blue coach at this link which doesn’t have such a box

Ken Jones

———

16/12/12 – 11:00

Yes, Ken, same here! So far as I know, Royal Blue coaches weren’t downgraded to DP or bus work, so they never needed that box in the dome.

Pete Davies

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16/12/12 – 12:14

United had some of these with a different front panel and destination layout. Drab olive green and cream sounds hideous for a coach livery, but anyone who has ever seen one of United’s coaches will tell you, it works, and these were no exception.

Ronnie Hoye

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16/12/12 – 14:44

Although some of the Royal Blue MW vehicles like EDV 502D had Western National branding instead of Royal Blue they never [thank goodness] received these horrible destination boxes. There’s a picture at this link showing ENOC with an equally horrible destination box

Ken Jones

———

16/12/12 – 17:31

The later vehicles with the deeper windscreens, such as the one in the link Ken posted never looked right to my eyes and I agree Ken, that thin profile linen display box looks very wrong. Not one of ECW’s best at all.

Berisford Jones

———

17/12/12 – 08:09

You are spot-on with your comments about the United olive green and cream livery Ronnie. It doesn’t sound great on paper, but ‘in the metal’ it had a touch of class. United’s Plaxton-bodied Bristol REMHs brought in a simpler more up to date style later on, yet they still looked stunning. They even retained the scroll-type fleet names.

Brendan Smith

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17/12/12 – 13:04

Brendan, going off the subject slightly, I know a couple of United L’s have survived into preservation ‘I believe one is in Durham District livery’ but do you know of any DP versions in the reverse livery?

Ronnie Hoye

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17/12/12 – 16:39

The full list of Bristol L survivors can be found at www.bristolsu.co.uk/  but I don’t think there is an United vehicle in reverse livery. Crosville KFM 893 is in reversed livery. HHN 202 is preserved in Durham District livery as seen at www.sct61.org.uk/

Ken Jones

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19/12/12 – 07:25

I noted above that I had vague memories of a Southern Vectis vehicle in the same special livery. I’ve found it, in a bought slide from Omnicolour. If you think this is bad, just consider a Bristol FS (VDL 844 to be precise!) then go and lie down in a darkened room until you recover.

Pete Davies

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19/12/12 – 13:42

On the same link Ken Jones mentions above, you will find a picture of one of these ‘7014 HN’ plus one or two other examples of United coaches, in particular is a 1964 Leyland Loepard L2 with Plaxton Panorama body, it became part of United’s fleet when they acquired Wilkinson of Spennymoor in 1968, but they all prove the point that quiet restraint is often more dignified than ‘flash and brash’

Ronnie Hoye

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20/12/12 – 07:54

Ronnie, sorry but I don’t know if there is a United Bristol L preserved in DP livery. The only ones I’m familiar with are in bus livery – HHN 202 (Durham District green) and two red LS – rear entrance LHN 823 and front entrance LHN 860. The latter vehicle made a touching appearance at Charlie Bullock’s funeral in Scarborough in August, complementing Charlie’s United K5G towing wagon FHN 923, which provided his ‘personal transport’ for the proceedings.

Brendan Smith

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20/12/12 – 09:45

Ronnie, I’ve just been reading through comments related to United Auto Bristol LL6B NHN 128 on this splendid website, which should interest you. Present owner David Hudson comments that this vehicle is awaiting restoration following fire damage. He also states that the vehicle was converted to DP configuration in 1953, so maybe you could yet see a United L-type in reversed livery.

Brendan Smith

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20/12/12 – 16:04

Thanks for that, Brendan, if NHN 128 were to be restored as a DP that ‘length and engine size apart’ would that make a full full set of L’s as far as United are concerned? A front and rear entrance in red, a reverse livery DP and a Green Durham District, or did D/D have DP’s as well?

Ronnie Hoye


 

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Old Bus Photos from Saturday 25th April 2009 to Wednesday 25th May 2016